DeAndre Hopkins/[Permission to seek trade/Its now or never/Elvis] Released!

[Foxx]

7 hours ago, Crap Throwing Clavin said:

... That's 9 - or 10, if you count Warner - of 33 quarterbacks that have won Superbowls.  That's a lot more than I expected.

But, of rookie contracts handed out, it's infinitesimal.

[Ann]

[Ann]

 

[Ann]

This is interesting

[Ann]

The usual suspects...
 

 

[Ann]

New agent

[Ann]

Whoa. This is worth the read.


 

Inside DeAndre Hopkins’s Release, and Why He Had No Value to Teams
The former Cardinals and Texans receiver’s options might include taking less from either the Chiefs or Bills to continue his NFL career.
- Albert Breer

The DeAndre Hopkins situation is, first and foremost, a lesson in NFL economics. In the end, Arizona couldn’t get anything for the star receiver it made a blockbuster trade for three years ago—and that most certainly isn’t an indication that he can’t play anymore nor that he might not have value to another team.

 

It’s that he didn’t have value … at $19.45 million.

 

The Cardinals were never going to pay him that. Neither were the other 31 teams. So that left Arizona to put Hopkins on the trading block at the start of the offseason, and wait. And wait. And wait. The Cardinals gave other teams permission to talk to him and his representation (he technically doesn’t have an agent, but financial adviser Saint Omni speaks for him in negotiations). They kept taking cash off their asking price, and were even willing to buy a draft pick as part of it.

 

</snip>

 

• The Cardinals were giving any teams who wanted to talk to Hopkins permission to do so. Two teams that got such permission, the Chiefs and Bills, spoke to Hopkins and Omni, and those two were the only two that engaged Arizona in trade talks. So the interest in giving up a pick or two to get Hopkins was pretty tepid.

 

• Arizona’s initial asking price was a second-round pick and another asset, but by the end, it was willing to part with him for a lot less than that. And my sense is it’d have considered picking up a chunk of his salary (obviously the higher the pick, the more it might give) to get, say, a top-100 pick. But, again, there simply wasn’t interest in paying Hopkins top dollar and giving up a Day 2 draft pick for him.

 

</snip>

 

• The Bills, similarly, were willing to do a pay-for-play sort of deal loaded with incentives. My feeling is that it leaves them in the same place the Chiefs are with Hopkins—the only way it happens is if his price comes down.

 

And if you add all that up, I think we get one of two conclusions. Either Hopkins finds someone to pay up and takes the bag. Or, he takes less to chase a ring with Kansas City or Buffalo, with the idea that putting together a full, healthy 2023 could burnish his legacy and perhaps set up one last payday next March.

 

</snip>

[IDBillzFan]

Ya gotta wonder what Watson can offer to DeAndre.

 

Oh, no. Wait. I know.

 

 

[Alaska Darin]

 

[Ann]

9 minutes ago, Alaska Darin said:

 

I am ok with his not landing in Buffalo, provided he doesn't land on KC or the Jets. 
I am also ok if he does land on the Bills, provided he doesn't cost a fortune and compromise the team's future... unless he is the final piece to their winning the Super Bowl this year. Then I don't care if it costs a bazillion dollars!


 

[Ann]

 

[IDBillzFan]

So the way the Chiefs can get him is to cut a Marquez Valdes-Scantling, who the Chiefs signed to a 3-year/$30M contract just last year.

 

Solid move.

 

 

Edited May 30, 2023 by IDBillzFan

[Alaska Darin]

2 minutes ago, IDBillzFan said:

So the way the Chiefs can get him is to cut a Marquez Valdes-Scantling, who the Chiefs signed to a 3-year/$30M contract just last year.

 

Solid move.

 

 

If they cut him before THIS season, his dead cap number is $10.44M.  It literally costs them $600k over that to keep him on the roster.

 

Not sure how that math adds up.

[IDBillzFan]

32 minutes ago, Alaska Darin said:

If they cut him before THIS season, his dead cap number is $10.44M.  It literally costs them $600k over that to keep him on the roster.

 

Not sure how that math adds up.

 

I suspect this is one of those people who wanted to gut the team after they lost to the Bills last year.

[SquirminThurman]

20 hours ago, Ninety-4 said:

No doubt Josh Allen's contract comes with a Hugh Jass cap number in the next several years which will limit what they can spend elsewhere.  The Chiefs are getting it done.  Patriots and Bucs did with Brady.  Salary cap is rumored to jump a bunch next year.  It's also fair to say that Josh will play better over the next 5 years than he did in the past 5 years.  I still like the Bill's chances going forward.  

I do too. Some times pointing out your beloved team has fallen short seems like being a downer. I love JA and this version of the Bills. But it doesn't mean that we should not question issues with the team. Some people would rather be in an rah rah echo chamber than have dissenting voices pointing out weaknesses.

 

I hope some of the OL adds helps out. I am higher on some and lower on some than others. I still think OL is the issue that needs to be figured out more than others. DL is second on the list.

 

That said I think this was a very solid offseason. I think the Bills have a solid chance to be the AFC East Champs again, and can compete with any team this year.

[Ann]

My fear

 

 

[Deranged Rhino]

6 hours ago, Ann said:

My fear

 

 

[SquirminThurman]

I've been saying this all along. Hopkins is a 'VOLUME WR.' He always has been, even going back to Houston. This is not to slight the guy. He is a very solid WR, but none of his metrics stood out in Houston, much less now. He needs to be fed to produce. He is and has always been mediocre per target.

 

Are you taking targets from Diggs? Davis didn't even have 100 targets last year in 15 games, are you taking his targets away? We all thought Knox needed more targets, are his dropping? Now you add Kincaide should we not target the rookie?

 

Look at 2022 again:

Hopkins: 9 games/ 96 targets/ 64 rec/ 717 yards/ 11.2 ypc/ 3 TD/ 35 1st downs

Davis: 15 games/ 93 targets/ 48 rec/ 836 yards/ 17.4 ypc/ 7 TD/ 35 1st downs

 

Hopkins basically got 2x the targets per game than Davis.

Hopkins targets/ game = 10.7

Davis targets/ game = 6.2

 

Who produced more on fewer total targets, and fewer targets per game?

836 yards > 717 Yards

17.4 YPC > 11.2 YPC

7 TD > 3 TD

35 1st downs = 35 1st downs

 

All of those metrics favor Gabe Davis. All of them.

It's even worse for Hopkins when you consider his high 'catch percentage'.

Davis did FAR MORE per catch AND per target than Hopkins the past two years, and Davis costs a fraction of Hopkins salary.

 

Davis and Hopkins are diametrically opposed. Davis puts up exceptional numbers in multiple metrics based on volume and catch. Hopkins needs higher volume to put up lesser metrics.

 

From the article Anne noted:

 

That said, there’s a healthy divide on exactly what Hopkins has left. I asked one veteran team executive what’s still there, and he answered, via text, “Not much. He can’t run anymore.” Another answer was pretty different—“He’s still a good player. Good route runner, big, physical target that can play a ball in the air. He’s still a threat.” And a third played both sides of it.

 

“Still great hands, he is not going to separate, not much of a deep threat, but very strong, and makes contested catches as well as anyone in the NFL,” the AFC exec said. “Does not love to practice—I can’t imagine that’ll get any better. And when things don’t go well, you’re always gonna be leery, All right, what kind of drama are we gonna get from this guy? When things are great, he’s great. When things go south, his true colors show a little bit."

 

I'm relieved to see some NFL personnel say the same things I have been saying all along.

 

[Spartacus]

1 hour ago, SquirminThurman said:

I've been saying this all along. Hopkins is a 'VOLUME WR.' He always has been, even going back to Houston. This is not to slight the guy. He is a very solid WR, but none of his metrics stood out in Houston, much less now. He needs to be fed to produce. He is and has always been mediocre per target.

 

Are you taking targets from Diggs? Davis didn't even have 100 targets last year in 15 games, are you taking his targets away? We all thought Knox needed more targets, are his dropping? Now you add Kincaide should we not target the rookie?

 

Look at 2022 again:

Hopkins: 9 games/ 96 targets/ 64 rec/ 717 yards/ 11.2 ypc/ 3 TD/ 35 1st downs

Davis: 15 games/ 93 targets/ 48 rec/ 836 yards/ 17.4 ypc/ 7 TD/ 35 1st downs

 

Hopkins basically got 2x the targets per game than Davis.

Hopkins targets/ game = 10.7

Davis targets/ game = 6.2

 

Who produced more on fewer total targets, and fewer targets per game?

836 yards > 717 Yards

17.4 YPC > 11.2 YPC

7 TD > 3 TD

35 1st downs = 35 1st downs

 

All of those metrics favor Gabe Davis. All of them.

It's even worse for Hopkins when you consider his high 'catch percentage'.

Davis did FAR MORE per catch AND per target than Hopkins the past two years, and Davis costs a fraction of Hopkins salary.

 

Davis and Hopkins are diametrically opposed. Davis puts up exceptional numbers in multiple metrics based on volume and catch. Hopkins needs higher volume to put up lesser metrics.

 

From the article Anne noted:

 

That said, there’s a healthy divide on exactly what Hopkins has left. I asked one veteran team executive what’s still there, and he answered, via text, “Not much. He can’t run anymore.” Another answer was pretty different—“He’s still a good player. Good route runner, big, physical target that can play a ball in the air. He’s still a threat.” And a third played both sides of it.

 

“Still great hands, he is not going to separate, not much of a deep threat, but very strong, and makes contested catches as well as anyone in the NFL,” the AFC exec said. “Does not love to practice—I can’t imagine that’ll get any better. And when things don’t go well, you’re always gonna be leery, All right, what kind of drama are we gonna get from this guy? When things are great, he’s great. When things go south, his true colors show a little bit."

 

I'm relieved to see some NFL personnel say the same things I have been saying all along.

 

for $5 mil for 2023, he may be worth it as insurance to take over Diggs volume, if he gets hurt.

However, who do you cut?

 

McDirty is already gone

the remaining guys all have upside which would hurt to lose

 

 

[Ann]

Hmmm