The Rocky Horror Picture Show

[Crap Throwing Clavin]

34 minutes ago, Cinga said:

 

 

Problem with the term Asian though is that India, Russia, Ukraine, Pakistan, Afghanistan and other none Oriental groups are technically, also Asian

Color me old fashioned if you want for knowing the difference

 

Russian is Slavic, not Asian.  Mongolian is Asian - Turkic, technically.  And "Chinese" isn't an ethnic group.  China contains more than 50 ethnic groups.

 

"Ethnicity" is more a tool for anthropologists.   When politicians or activists get a hold of it, it becomes pretty damned stupid.

 

[Joe Miner]

1 hour ago, Crap Throwing Clavin said:

 

Was an ethnic group as recently as 2016.  Will be again someday, when people decide they're offended by the term "Asian."

 

Asian is a stupid term.

[Crap Throwing Clavin]

2 minutes ago, Joe Miner said:

 

Asian is a stupid term.

 

I know you don't really mean that, and you're just saying it in the heat of the moment.

[Jauronimo]

1 hour ago, Cinga said:

 

 

Problem with the term Asian though is that India, Russia, Ukraine and other none Oriental groups are technically, also Asian

Color me old fashioned if you want for knowing the difference

Ukraine is in Europe.  Oriental is a term that was coined sometime in the 14th century to describe all the exotic people who exist beyond western Europe.  Its a term that can just as accurately describe someone from Damascus as someone from Beijing.  In more modern times it was a pan Asian term for anyone east of India.  Truly "knowing the difference" would disqualify anyone from continuing to refer to people as oriental.  

 

Also, no one refers to minority status on the basis of global populations.  The fact that there are 2 billion people in china means little to the only chinese american kid in a Nebraska classroom whose mother packed him stinky tofu for lunch again.

[Crap Throwing Clavin]

2 minutes ago, Jauronimo said:

Ukraine is in Europe.  Oriental is a term that was coined sometime in the 14th century to describe all the exotic people who exist beyond western Europe.  Its a term that can just as accurately describe someone from Damascus as someone from Beijing.  In more modern times it was a pan Asian term for anyone east of India.  Truly "knowing the difference" would disqualify anyone from continuing to refer to people as oriental.  

 

Also, no one refers to minority status on the basis of global populations.  The fact that there are 2 billion people in china means little to the only chinese american kid in a Nebraska classroom whose mother packed him stinky tofu for lunch again.

 

And the verb "to orient" literally means to face, or cause something, to face east.  

 

Remember that.  The next time you're in any sort of orientation, and facing north, you're quite simply incorrect.  

[Cinga]

27 minutes ago, Jauronimo said:

Ukraine is in Europe.

 

My mistake, it was a part of the former Soviet Union which was always considered to be Asia

 

27 minutes ago, Jauronimo said:

Also, no one refers to minority status on the basis of global populations.  The fact that there are 2 billion people in china means little to the only chinese american kid in a Nebraska classroom whose mother packed him stinky tofu for lunch again.

 

Sorry, since almost everything is based on globalism now I thought we could disregard this minority bullshit but I guess not if it can be used to make a ridiculous point

[Cinga]

Some people are trying awfully hard to look like the abortion statue in NYC lately

 

[Jauronimo]

22 minutes ago, Cinga said:

 

My mistake, it was a part of the former Soviet Union which was always considered to be Asia

 

 

Sorry, since almost everything is based on globalism now I thought we could disregard this minority bullshit but I guess not if it can be used to make a ridiculous point

Speaking of ridiculous points...

 

Guy who still calls people "oriental" is pretty sure there are no issues with DEI in the workplace or schools. First hand accounts of people making up less than 10% of the population in this country are irrelevant because theres a couple billion "orientals" somewhere else. 

 

This is an interesting way of showing your appreciation for educating you on a topic and sparing you future embarrassment.   By all means, continue to group people based on a cardinal direction when located in 14th century france and facing vaguely east.

 

Also, don't quote me on this, but I'm pretty sure that the Urals did not shift based on soviet influence in Europe. Like 95% sure. As always, DYOR. 

Edited April 11, 2023 by Jauronimo

[Crap Throwing Clavin]

28 minutes ago, Cinga said:

 

My mistake, it was a part of the former Soviet Union which was always considered to be Asia

 

 

Sorry, since almost everything is based on globalism now I thought we could disregard this minority bullshit but I guess not if it can be used to make a ridiculous point

 

Literally, the first time I've ever heard of the Soviet Union being Asia.

[Joe Miner]

1 hour ago, Crap Throwing Clavin said:

 

I know you don't really mean that, and you're just saying it in the heat of the moment.

 

What does it mean?

[Crap Throwing Clavin]

28 minutes ago, Joe Miner said:

 

What does it mean?

 

Seriously?  You missed the joke?

[4merper4mer]

2 minutes ago, Crap Throwing Clavin said:

 

Seriously?  You missed the joke?

When he gets it, and finds out how lame it is, the smile will leave his eyes.

[Jauronimo]

1 hour ago, Joe Miner said:

 

What does it mean?

I think Tom, in his own way, is trying to say he never meant to be so bad to you.  One thing he said that he would never do.

[Ann]

1 hour ago, Crap Throwing Clavin said:

 

Literally, the first time I've ever heard of the Soviet Union being Asia.

I said to my husband the only way we'd ever get to Asia is to go to Russia. He said, "That's not really Asia."  Well,  geographically, it is. 

[Jauronimo]

1 minute ago, Ann said:

I said to my husband the only way we'd ever get to Asia is to go to Russia. He said, "That's not really Asia."  Well,  geographically, it is. 

I'll take fresh grilled fish on the beach in Bali over cold beet soup and track suits 11 out of 10 days.  The Asian side of Russia is where political dissidents wound up and for good reason.  I would consider going for cheap caviar or to write a novel while rapidly descending into madness during a bleak russian winter.  But a return trip to Thailand, Indonesia, or Japan just sounds like more fun right now.

 

 

 

 

[Ann]

3 minutes ago, Jauronimo said:

I'll take fresh grilled fish on the beach in Bali over cold beet soup and track suits 11 out of 10 days.  The Asian side of Russia is where political dissidents wound up and for good reason.  I would consider going for cheap caviar or to write a novel while rapidly descending into madness during a bleak russian winter.  But a return trip to Thailand, Indonesia, or Japan just sounds like more fun right now.

 

Just about anywhere in the world sounds more fun than Russia right about now...

[Nouseforaname]

14 minutes ago, Jauronimo said:

I'll take fresh grilled fish on the beach in Bali over cold beet soup and track suits 11 out of 10 days.  The Asian side of Russia is where political dissidents wound up and for good reason.  I would consider going for cheap caviar or to write a novel while rapidly descending into madness during a bleak russian winter.  But a return trip to Thailand, Indonesia, or Japan just sounds like more fun right now.

 

 

 

 

 

Just wait until they win this war and bring back traditional values.

[Crap Throwing Clavin]

1 hour ago, Ann said:

I said to my husband the only way we'd ever get to Asia is to go to Russia. He said, "That's not really Asia."  Well,  geographically, it is. 

 

Geographically, Siberia and Mongolia are.  "Russia" ends at the Urals, everything else is imperial annexation.  Sort-of...given that the Mongols invaded southern "Russia" (the Kievan 'Rus) in the 13th century, it was technically all unified, I guess...until the Mongol Empire fragmented into the four different Khanates, and the Golden Horde ended up controlling it.

 

Honestly...it all gets very ambiguous.  American history post-dates the Peace of Westphalia, so our only context in the Western Hemisphere is nation-states.  In Eurasia, they have millennia of history and culture that doesn't fit in to that context at all.  Probably the biggest reason our sense of history and international relations is so warped.

 

Always wanted to go to Russia, to visit Kursk and Volgograd (military history stuff.)  "The Motherland Calls" in Volgograd is impressive enough in pictures, it must be awesome in person.  Kursk...it'd be interesting to visit Prokhorovka with a metal detector; there's got to be as much shit buried in the ground there as at Gettysburg.  (Not to recover any of it, of course - that's probably as illegal as at Gettysburg.)

[Jauronimo]

53 minutes ago, Crap Throwing Clavin said:

 

Geographically, Siberia and Mongolia are.  "Russia" ends at the Urals, everything else is imperial annexation.  Sort-of...given that the Mongols invaded southern "Russia" (the Kievan 'Rus) in the 13th century, it was technically all unified, I guess...until the Mongol Empire fragmented into the four different Khanates, and the Golden Horde ended up controlling it.

 

Honestly...it all gets very ambiguous.  American history post-dates the Peace of Westphalia, so our only context in the Western Hemisphere is nation-states.  In Eurasia, they have millennia of history and culture that doesn't fit in to that context at all.  Probably the biggest reason our sense of history and international relations is so warped.

 

Always wanted to go to Russia, to visit Kursk and Volgograd (military history stuff.)  "The Motherland Calls" in Volgograd is impressive enough in pictures, it must be awesome in person.  Kursk...it'd be interesting to visit Prokhorovka with a metal detector; there's got to be as much shit buried in the ground there as at Gettysburg.  (Not to recover any of it, of course - that's probably as illegal as at Gettysburg.)

I am still trying to figure out where we went wrong on delivering democracy to reluctant nations formed by colonial rule and held together by brutal dictators, primarily consisting of tribes and clans with centuries of history, no concept of nationalism, that would sooner settle old blood feuds than work together to form a system of governance.  

[Crap Throwing Clavin]

7 minutes ago, Jauronimo said:

I am still trying to figure out where we went wrong on delivering democracy to reluctant nations formed by colonial rule and held together by brutal dictators, primarily consisting of tribes and clans with centuries of history, no concept of nationalism, that would sooner settle old blood feuds than work together to form a system of governance.  

 

I just read this:  https://www.amazon.com/Destiny-Disrupted-History-Through-Islamic/dp/1586488139  It had an interesting perspective on the topic.

 

Also made an interesting point that the Crusades really weren't that big a deal in the Islamic world.  The idea that they were is a modern anti-colonial construct - a modern Western anti-colonial construct, derived more from the principle of European exceptionalism than anything else.

 

It was a good read, I recommend it.

 

Just read a great book on Pelileu, too.  I really ought to start a "What's Tom reading?" thread, now that I'm out of my man-killing job and have time to read for pleasure again.